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Donaldson To Will: Teabaggers Aren't Mad About Taxes, They Just Don't Like Obama

Seeded on Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:02 PM EDT
Read ArticleArticle Source: Crooks and Liars
politics, republicans, democrats, gop, tea-party, teabaggers, tea-parties, george-will, peggy-noonan, boston-tea-party, sam-donaldson
Seeded by PowerIsKnowledge
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Heh. Sam Donaldson really smacks down the ever-unctuous (and historically inaccurate) George Will on This Week's roundtable discussion about the teabaggers:

WILL: What this was about, as was the original Boston Tea Party - which was barely about taxes but about Parliament's role in their lives, was a view that we're now in something called the "third wave" of government. You had the expansion of the New Deal, you had the expansion of the Great Society to complete the New Deal, what those people who rallied there were saying this is something different, this third wave is to erase the distinction between the public and private sectors, and that frightens them.

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  • Public Discussion (41)
PowerIsKnowledge

DONALDSON: Oh, they weren't saying that, George. What they were saying is, we don't like Obama. And this is a proxy way to say that. Because it's true, he's going to lower taxes on 95% of the American public, and the rest are going to have higher taxes. You were quite correct, it's not about the level of taxes. Those rallies were mainly, it seems to me, organized to say, "We don't like Obama" across the board.

Donaldson didn't bite his tongue on this! He called a spade a spade!

  • 8 votes
Reply#1 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:04 PM EDT
igoforo

Oh he lowered my taxes ? The 17 dollars I get ever pay period is burned up and then some because the federal government can't fund states and local governments as before so instead of cutting staff on the local level they are increasing local property taxes to cover the short fall. The cost? $39.00 a month. $34.00 -39.00 = -4.00 wheres my tax cut? Good try Obamawan thanks but no thanks. its always been about policy and if we can't protest policy then we can't protest anything.

  • 2 votes
#1.1 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:22 PM EDT
Oliver Shagnastey

Sam was wrong. Most of the reporting on the T.E.A. is incorrect!

But what can we expect from those as out of touch as Sam, and Chucky, etc.

Obama is our dully elected President, and we will support him when he is right, and we will exercise our constitutional right to demonstrate and show our disagreement with him when we feel he is wrong! This will happen whether Sam likes it or not!

Some fear President Obama's intentions and do not trust him. And it is their right to express that fact!

  • 2 votes
#1.2 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:26 PM EDT
SpoxLogic

igoforo, instead of being down -$5, you'd be down -$39. Since I am sure the property tax raise was voted on long before the tax cut. So, even though you can't go on that Hawaii vacation, it did take a bite out of what your local pols did to you.

  • 6 votes
#1.3 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:27 PM EDT
Bob-725866

Oliver you certainly have the right to protest, it's liberating, more power to you. The tea baggers would be taken more seriously if they dropped the pretense of it being about taxes, stop lying that it isn't about Obama and be forthright about what they are about.

  • 6 votes
#1.4 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:46 PM EDT
dmessina

Keep on telling yourself that. Maybe if you keep repeating it, it might become true. Not.

  • 2 votes
#1.5 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:22 PM EDT
igoforo

No spox

The increase is due to the lack of funding there was no increase planned until the down turn and the funding was changed and just think our state government is still fighting and our governor is saying no to tax increases and the democratic senate and house are saying yes. so much for -5.00 it may go higher. God my math sucked didn't it LOL

    #1.6 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 11:39 PM EDT
    PowerIsKnowledge

    Oh he lowered my taxes ? The 17 dollars I get ever pay period is burned up and then some because the federal government can't fund states and local governments as before so instead of cutting staff on the local level they are increasing local property taxes to cover the short fall. The cost? $39.00 a month. $34.00 -39.00 = -4.00 wheres my tax cut?

    The homeless, the unemployed, and the low income wouldn't consider this a joke.

    • 2 votes
    #1.7 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:52 AM EDT
    igoforo

    most of those people don't pay taxes and if the do they get it all back and thus don't pay taxes. I pay taxes and usually pay in at the end of the year and I don't mind that what I mind is the out of control spending and the waste in every program ever implemented by government and how every single company that has a government contract abuses the government and makes them pay more then you and I can get it for.Everybody thinks thats just business and it isn't its just wrong. government also should not be asking for the best of everything it really should only get what works for the job that needs to be done.Also think about what you just said. Unemployed, homeless and low income.

      #1.8 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:15 AM EDT
      Reply
      Timothy Lingard

      I believe he is right. This doesn't have a thing to do with taxes. If they cared about taxes so as they say, then they would have been doing something over the past eight years.

      • 11 votes
      Reply#2 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:18 PM EDT
      Oliver Shagnastey

      Tim, you must not have a grasp of the numbers. OH! Yes! a great many of the people that protested did not like what Bush did, nor did they agree with his policies!

      • 2 votes
      #2.1 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:28 PM EDT
      Ed Wood

      Many of us were complaining and writing our congressmen, etc. about budget excesses.

      I think if you analyze the mix at the Tea Party you will see the core to be Ron Paul Republicans and Libertarians, many of whom were against the budget increases and the war. Many others may have been against the budget increases but kept quiet because they supported the troops and the war. This was the case with most of the Republicans that I personally know.

      • 1 vote
      #2.2 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:48 PM EDT
      RNoel-525230

      Tim, you must not have a grasp of the numbers. OH! Yes! a great many of the people that protested did not like what Bush did, nor did they agree with his policies!

      Yes, those people are called "Democrats" and were called un-American and traitors when they protested what Bush did.   Now the other side is doing the same thing, and somehow they're not hypocrites.

      • 6 votes
      #2.3 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:50 PM EDT
      Oliver Shagnastey

      RNoel, you are totally wrong on this issue. The people involved in the T.E.A. demonstrations were a mix, a representative cross section of the population!

      • 1 vote
      #2.4 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:17 AM EDT
      Reply
      solchef13

      The veneer is so thin on this it's insulting.

      The only group that would actually benefit from the "tea parties" taking off are the Republicans.

      The tea parties aren't a movement to gain rights or change laws, it is a platform to voice a general dissatisfaction with the current government, thinly disguised as a "tax protest". If it takes off, the implication is, of course, that the current administration needs to be changed. Let me think, in a two party system when you want to change something you are led to the other party as the alternative.

      With this as with all things, to find out who is really behind something, look for who will reap the greatest benefit.

      It is so obvious I am truly saddened for any Non Republican that fall for this crap.

      • 8 votes
      Reply#3 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:32 PM EDT
      Ed Wood

      Ridiculous. If nothing else it is exposing a large number of people to the science of economics.

      It will more than likely turn the Republican party more libertarian, a direction it was slowly moving anyway. That's a good thing.

      Everybody I know that went had a good time. That's another good thing.

      We are dissatified with the current administration. It pretty much doing everything we warned it would do, pretty much exactly the way we warned it would. Besides the hyperbole about gun control I would have to say that all but the most radical criticism is dead on.

      I personally would rather spend my time beating the socialism out of the Republican Party then fighting avowed socialist while they are in office.

      • 1 vote
      #3.1 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:04 PM EDT
      Chuck1968

      Ridiculous. If nothing else it is exposing a large number of people to the science of economics.

      Hopefully that's true and then they will see how utterly ridiculous the tea baggin' parties really are. Economic data supports the type of stimulation that Obama is utilizing currently, the data does NOT support the idea that tax cuts.

      Your "warnings" are invalid --It's too bad that conservatives are so self centered they just don't get it . Conservative ideas created the damage --conservative ideas put this burden on the taxpayers and conservative taxpayers have the obligation to support getting us back on course.

      Conservatives have a lot of nerve pointing the finger at the current administration for the problems created by those people whose policies they supported.

      The entire conservative rant is hyperbole. In fact it's safe to say the entire right wing has become even bigger drama queens then they were during Bush's terms while pushing the liberating Iraq crap to keep the egg off there faces.

      I mean of course, the embarrassment of being totally wrong should be avoided at all costs , even if it would save the lives of our troops.

      • 4 votes
      #3.2 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 12:07 AM EDT
      Ed Wood

      Which data are you talking about. As far as I know Keynesian type spending like we are seeing now has done nothing more than extend unemployment and set us up for the next crash.

      Any objective analysis of what led to the current problems will show a mix of causes, none of which include conservative, by which I mean liberal free market ideas. The cause of these problems was chiefly government meddling and deviation from free market ideals. Even the egregious displays of greed and fraud were abetted by government regulation. A free market will weed out the thieves and con-men through competition.

      The war is really irrelevant. If people didn't speak up about the spending for fear of damaging the war effort I am glad they are speaking up now. It is never to late to do the right thing. If their is any one who feels this describes their feelings maybe they would like to explain here. I to found it hard to criticize my government while it was involved in what appeared to me to be a just war.

      • 1 vote
      #3.3 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:03 AM EDT
      PowerIsKnowledge

      We are dissatified with the current administration.

      So were the Tea Bag parties objections to President Obama or taxes?

      • 1 vote
      #3.4 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 6:58 AM EDT
      Ed Wood

      Speaking for myself, I was objecting to taxes and the actions of President Obama's administration, and the Democratically controlled Congress which will lead to a reduction in the American standard of living in the near future.

      • 1 vote
      #3.5 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:48 PM EDT
      solchef13

      Speaking for myself, I was supportingtaxes and the actions of President Obama's administration, and the Democratically controlled Congress which will lead to a increase in the American standard of living in the near future.

      An amazing lack of anything resembling facts or statistics, I like my version better, sounds more......hopeful?

      • 2 votes
      #3.6 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 4:13 PM EDT
      Reply
      Miss_Diagnosed

      With all these articles about teabagging, Im starting to get nervous about our country's morality...

      Just kidding

      • 2 votes
      Reply#4 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:41 PM EDT
      Gnostix1

      Notice that when it comes to conservatives, they always consistently attack the legitimacy of any Democrat who wins the White House. So no Democrat is ever really the President, and should be challenged at every turn! There, wasn't that easy?

      A very good observation. Clinton's legitimacy was questioned from the start as he did not have a plurality of voters though he won the electoral. No such squawks about GWBush -- who's election was a far more egregious miscarriage of the electoral process in both elections.
      Obama won hands down by every measure yet you still hear sniping about "how close" the election was, how wing-nuts "aren't represented" etc.

      Memo to republicans: You lost fair and square. Stop whining and own up.

      • 9 votes
      Reply#5 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:47 PM EDT
      Tappy McWidestance

      Memo to republicans: You lost fair and square. Stop whining and own up.

      Or as Rush Limbough is fond of saying... "Until you win an election, shut up!"

      • 4 votes
      #5.1 - Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:00 PM EDT
      Ed Wood

      Give me a break. Democrats are still whining about the "stolen elections" of 2000 and 2004, as evidenced by Gnostic1's post.

      GWBush -- who's election was a far more egregious miscarriage of the electoral process in both elections.

      I have resigned myself to listening to this nonsense until the day I die.

      • 1 vote
      #5.2 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:12 AM EDT
      Reply
      Oliver Shagnastey

      Sam Donaldson was wrong! Most of the reporting on the T.E.A. is incorrect!

      But what can we expect from those as out of touch as Sam, and Chucky Todd, etc.?

      Obama is our dully elected President, and we will support him when he is right, and we will exercise our constitutional right to demonstrate and show our disagreement with him when we feel he is wrong! This will happen whether Sam likes it or not!

      The demonstrators were a representative cross section of the country. They are concerned and frightened by the spending. They are a mix of political ideologies that agree on the issue of taxes and debit!

      The easiest way to attempt to counter the demonstrations is to accuse them of darker things!

      Some fear President Obama's intentions and do not trust him. And it is their right to express that fact!

      • 1 vote
      Reply#6 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:24 AM EDT
      Bob-725866

      For me it just keeps going back to why didn't the spending and 10.5 TRILLION dollar debt worry you when it was Bush? Why all the sudden concern and protesting? Why now? Why wait until we are in an economic Tsunami, 7 million people have lost their jobs and countless others have lost their business's or homes and NOW you decide to care? Sorry, seems a little disingenuous to me.

      • 1 vote
      #6.1 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:46 PM EDT
      Ed Wood

      How many times do we have to tell you it did worry us.

      • 2 votes
      #6.2 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:49 PM EDT
      Bob-725866

      Ed - I live here in DC, I'd've heard of or seen a tea party or ANYTHING of the sort. Bush was elected to a second term, now there's a funny way to show how worried you were. Even if I accept you all were worried why did you wait till NOW to speak out? Why not when Bush kicked pay-as-you-go aside, or passed UNFUNDED tax cuts, or took the wars and prescription drug plan off budget, why keep your worries to yourself until NOW? Why were people who spoke out against Bush's spending called traitors and Anti-American?

      • 2 votes
      #6.3 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 3:10 PM EDT
      solchef13

      Ed, please post just one single link to a Bush era tea party or ANY kind of rightwing anti-tax/anti-deficit/lower debt demonstration.

        #6.4 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 4:15 PM EDT
        Oliver Shagnastey

        The people I know that observed T.E.A. were not all that happy with Bush. But he is gone, so we must deal with those in power NOW!

        • 2 votes
        #6.5 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:16 PM EDT
        Bob-725866

        How convenient, you don't like Bush so you elect him twice and then within a couple months of the new guy getting in you are marching in the streets. Sorry, seems a little disingenuous to me.

        • 3 votes
        #6.6 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:13 AM EDT
        Oliver Shagnastey

        You are not accepting the fact that the people that participated in the T.E.A. demonstrations represent a cross section. Many of them never voted for Bush!

        Many are independent, some republican, and some democrats.

        • 1 vote
        #6.7 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:26 AM EDT
        Bob-725866

        It doesn't matter who they voted for or who they are, this mixed group of people is protesting "spending" that was rampant under Bush for 8 years, then Obama gets in and within months this group materializes and is marching in the streets. They could have just as easily done it under Bush. Why NOW?

        I wish we had a better way of measuring demographics etc because I'd love to know the actual make-up of the crowd. Somebody on the Vine last night was trying to convince me everybody is welcome, not just conservatives, and then she called me a socialist. I think it is a good thing to protest, I am not arguing you shouldn't be, I am suspect of the timing and the advertised reason that's all.

        • 1 vote
        #6.8 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:10 AM EDT
        Ed Wood

        Bob, It is a function of always feeling one always has to vote for the lesser of two evils. I voted for Bush twice because I felt the alternatives were far worse.

        • 2 votes
        #6.9 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:47 AM EDT
        Bob-725866

        Now in retrospect it is hard to imagine how anybody could have possibly been worse, I think we would have been better off with the others but we'll never know.

        • 1 vote
        #6.10 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 12:46 PM EDT
        Reply
        PowerIsKnowledge

        #6.3 - Why not when Bush kicked pay-as-you-go aside, or passed UNFUNDED tax cuts, or took the wars and prescription drug plan off budget, why keep your worries to yourself until NOW? Why were people who spoke out against Bush's spending called traitors and Anti-American?

        Bob-725866, I don't believe this question will ever be answered.

        • 2 votes
        Reply#7 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 3:59 PM EDT
        Ed Wood

        Revising history, Power? I don't remember anyone being called Anti-American for questioning spending. I do recall people being called Anti-American for questioning the funding of the war. There were plenty of conservatives questioning the spending. Libertarians questioned it from the start.

        • 1 vote
        #7.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:51 AM EDT
        Reply
        jmjpfu

        "Donaldson" in this discussion definitely got it right!

        All the usual whiners, malcontents, pseudopatriots, mad dogs, seditionists, fearmongers, hatepanderers, psychopartisans, professional and wannabe character assassins, are inevitably devoting all their natural skills to destroying this Administration's genuinely attempting real reform decades overdue, and completing W's and Cheney's and their cronies' nihilist destruction of the American dream spiritually / politically / economcly.

        Aren't there enough third-world cultures already?

        Red, Whte, Blue, and True!

          Reply#8 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:53 PM EDT
          Oliver Shagnastey

          jmjpfu; your remarks mirror that memo that described our returning veterans as possible terrorist or extremist, along with gun owners and some others that did not parrot the administrations line.

          Is it wrong for citizens to demonstrate peacefully when they wish to bring attention to issues that they are concerned about. It seems that I saw a banner unfurled in front of a speaker and his speech disrupted by hooligans, but no one complained about their infringement on that person right to free speech.

          Please be consistant!

          • 1 vote
          Reply#9 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:35 AM EDT
          Oliver Shagnastey

          I saw the broadcast that this article is about, and Sam attempted to smack, George Will, but Will is a dignified gentleman, and Sam made a fool of himself with an obvious attempt to belittle the honest protest by average citizens!

          • 1 vote
          Reply#10 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:05 AM EDT
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